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d80 v 400d v k10d v 30d v ?
Im new and have been reading everything I can find in anticipation of my first dslr purchase. my price limit is about $1000..

I was sold on the k10d until I saw how bad the image processor was in comparison to the others. I really liked the shake reduction, as my wife cant keep her hands still when taking photos..

The camera will be used primarily to take photos of the kids. I want something that will help with photos of the kids in low light, which is hard because they move like lightning. it also must have auto focus and have a quick startup..

The menu needs to be easy to use and have generous presets. my wife will get frustrated if it's overly complicated..

Ive narrowed it down to the above but really cant say..

Any opinions? is there a model that I'm missing? or maybe a combination of body and lense that would serve my needs?thank you in advance..

If this has been covered endlessly, could someone link me? I dont mind reading up on my own...

Comments (12)

Hiya Paz.

While shake reduction does help in low light situations, ie.. enabling you to shoot a couple of stops lower then you usually would, it is pretty much useless for capturing fast moving action (ie..kids) so the Pentax may not be offering a whole lot that will be helpful to you in that sense. In saying that, the Pentax does offer a lot of bangs per bucks, probably more then any of the other cameras you have listed, so you may want to consider teaming it with a good flash or fast lens both of which will certainly do the job for you..

The D80, 400D and 30D are all excellent cameras in terms of focus speed and startup with Canon probably having a slight edge in high ISO performance which is much more useful for capturing indoor action. The bigger advantage that both the Canon and Nikon systems have over Pentax is the upgrade flexibility in both lenses and accessories if you should wish to take your photography to a more professional level..

Bottom line I suppose, if all you see yourself doing in the future is taking many happy photos of the kids growing up, go for the Pentax. If you think you may want to do more then that in the future, go for the Nikon or Canon..

Regards.

Steve.

Paz9x wrote:.

Im new and have been reading everything I can find in anticipation ofmy first dslr purchase. my price limit is about $1000.i was sold on the k10d until I saw how bad the image processor was incomparison to the others. I really liked the shake reduction, as mywife cant keep her hands still when taking photos.the camera will be used primarily to take photos of the kids. I wantsomething that will help with photos of the kids in low light, whichis hard because they move like lightning. it also must have autofocus and have a quick startup.the menu needs to be easy to use and have generous presets. my wifewill get frustrated if it's overly complicated..

Ive narrowed it down to the above but really cant say.any opinions? is there a model that I'm missing? or maybe acombination of body and lense that would serve my needs?thank you in advance.if this has been covered endlessly, could someone link me? I dontmind reading up on my own...

Comment #1

I am probably as much of a fanboy as Steve. But honestly, I sincerely believe, that in it's range the K10D is hands down the winner. entry level is a D40X/E410 toss up and above that Canon and Nikon have the the pro level cameras on lock down with no significant competition from anywhere. The K10D not only has shake reduction, but full weather sealing, but also a self cleaning sensor. I will say the two things though in all honesty that the Pentax line up suffers from is Noise levels at high ISO, a plague of Nikon as well, and AF hunting, a problem of Canons. From ISO 800 and down Pentax is awesome and if you invest in quality lenses you wont suffer from AF hunting.

I am very happy with my K10D and I would recommend it to anyone. The only complaint I have is that Pentax has no real "Pro" grade bodies. If you are looking to upgrade in the future the 400 xti and D80 might be the only way to go...

Comment #2

Pretty much agree with jscoby here, only real reason I am locked into a Canon system is my requirement for a 5D level body for studio work. If Pentax could get a 'pro' level body into the market place at a reasonable price it would really give the Caniikon empire something to worry about..

Regards.

Steve.

Jscoby05 wrote:.

I am probably as much of a fanboy as Steve. But honestly, I sincerelybelieve, that in it's range the K10D is hands down the winner. entrylevel is a D40X/E410 toss up and above that Canon and Nikon have thethe pro level cameras on lock down with no significant competitionfrom anywhere. The K10D not only has shake reduction, but fullweather sealing, but also a self cleaning sensor. I will say the twothings though in all honesty that the Pentax line up suffers from isNoise levels at high ISO, a plague of Nikon as well, and AF hunting,a problem of Canons. From ISO 800 and down Pentax is awesome and ifyou invest in quality lenses you wont suffer from AF hunting.

I am very happy with my K10D and I would recommend it toanyone. The only complaint I have is that Pentax has no real "Pro"grade bodies. If you are looking to upgrade in the future the 400 xtiand D80 might be the only way to go...

Comment #3

I would even put a plug in for the K100D Super. I like the more pro feel of the K10D but this is one sweet handling camera. It does have the AS from the K10D and is now compatible with the SDM lenses...

Comment #4

Hi paz -.

I too looked at the Canons & Nikons, and the Sony A100, before deciding on a K10d. (In film cameras I have two Nikon SLRs - FM & F2 - and love them.).

The Canons - both the ones you mentioned - have viewfinders that are just too small and dim for comfort (I mean the actual size of the image as seen by your eye), so they were out..

The D80 is a very nice camera. Large, bright viewfinder, shake reduction (but in the lens - only certain lens, good image quality), but it comes at a price. If money were no object, I probably would have gone for it, esp. given my bias towards Nikon film cameras..

The Sony also suffered from the small viewfinder problem..

That left the K10. I was also concerned about the "image processor problem", primarily from the review here at dpreview. But on closer reading of it, I realized that they were saying the problem is with the jpeg files that the camera produces - it is not an inherent problem of the camera or the camera's sensor. In fact, if you look at pg. 21 of that review (think it was pg. 21 - somewhere near there), where they are comparing RAW files from the K10D and the D80, processed outside the camera in Adobe Camera Raw, they said that the K10D's images were the equal of if not slightly better than the D80's..

That's really what settled it for me in the K10's favor, and made me decide that the D80 wasn't worth the extra expense. That and the fact that it's got the SR built into the body, and the large, bright viewfinder..

Having the K10 now for about 4 months, I'd say I'm very pleased with it. There are no serious quality problems with the jpeg's it produces, although most of the time I shoot RAW. Given the use you indicated, IMHO you'd have no problems with the jpegs. If you ever felt a need for the absolute best quality the camera can produce, you can shoot RAW and process in ACR (pick up Photoshop Elements 5.0 on ebay for $35 and it comes with the latest version.).

Whatever you decide - have fun!.

Paz9x wrote:.

Im new and have been reading everything I can find in anticipation ofmy first dslr purchase. my price limit is about $1000.i was sold on the k10d until I saw how bad the image processor was incomparison to the others. I really liked the shake reduction, as mywife cant keep her hands still when taking photos.the camera will be used primarily to take photos of the kids. I wantsomething that will help with photos of the kids in low light, whichis hard because they move like lightning. it also must have autofocus and have a quick startup.the menu needs to be easy to use and have generous presets. my wifewill get frustrated if it's overly complicated..

Ive narrowed it down to the above but really cant say.any opinions? is there a model that I'm missing? or maybe acombination of body and lense that would serve my needs?thank you in advance.if this has been covered endlessly, could someone link me? I dontmind reading up on my own..

Rich..

Comment #5

K10D is clear winner now beacuse camera body stabilisation. Buy 50mm AF lens and you will be all set for kids / indoor phtotography..

Canon's mid range IS L lens will cost you > $1,000..

Sony newcomer A700 with camera bases stabilisation compatible with Minolta G glass will shake Canon's ground on amateour photography market very well..

Take a look at dim light shot I made handheld with previous generation in-body stabilisation camera/50mm lens combination 1/6 sec. Minolta 7D.

Image control:Zoom outZoom 100%Zoom inExpand AllOpen in new window.

When fast moving objects come in as argument, external bounce flash works darn well:.

Image control:Zoom outZoom 100%Zoom inExpand AllOpen in new window.

Http://www.stan-pustylnik.smugmug.com..

Comment #6

This is one of the biggest areas of issue for me..

I get this impression that if prices were equal the d80 is the way to go followed closely by the 400d. (im concerned with the metering of the 400d though).

$200-300 variance between those and the k10d is not a deciding factor. I really want the best camera for my purposes, that I can afford ($1k).

I have no plans of upgrading however I'd like to have the option to do so without buying another body..

Im leaning heavily towards buying a 50mm and would like to have a kit lense as well. I would stay with this configuration indefinately..

In a review, not sure where, I had read the pentax is not as friendly to inexperienced photographers as the menus require a bit of photography knowledge as it does not have presets like the canon and the nikon to a lesser degree..

This is a big issue as my wife doesnt understand these things and has no desire to..

These issues coupled with the lack of local availiblity to play with each is driving me nuts..

Each posters response has been helpful, thank you..

Jscoby05 wrote:.

I am probably as much of a fanboy as Steve. But honestly, I sincerelybelieve, that in it's range the K10D is hands down the winner. entrylevel is a D40X/E410 toss up and above that Canon and Nikon have thethe pro level cameras on lock down with no significant competitionfrom anywhere. The K10D not only has shake reduction, but fullweather sealing, but also a self cleaning sensor. I will say the twothings though in all honesty that the Pentax line up suffers from isNoise levels at high ISO, a plague of Nikon as well, and AF hunting,a problem of Canons. From ISO 800 and down Pentax is awesome and ifyou invest in quality lenses you wont suffer from AF hunting.

I am very happy with my K10D and I would recommend it toanyone. The only complaint I have is that Pentax has no real "Pro"grade bodies. If you are looking to upgrade in the future the 400 xtiand D80 might be the only way to go...

Comment #7

For the point-and-shoot crowd, I would recommend the Pentax K100D Super, the Canon Rebel XT/XTi, the Nikon D40, the Nikon D40x or the Olympus E-500. Why? The K10D is geared towards more serious photographers and does not have scene modes. The entire control layout is geared towards fast and efficient manual control of aperture, ISO and shutter speed. It's absolutely wonderful when shooting in wildly changing environments, but it's not quite suited for the point-and-shoot crowd..

Additionally, I don't really recommend starting off with other higher-end cameras like the Nikon D80 and Canon 30D. As a beginner, you won't get better pictures out of these cameras. Buy an entry level SLR and save your money. That money is MUCH better spent on taking photography classes that cover composition and photographic lighting. The things you learn from good composition and proper lighting will improve your photos much more than getting a better body..

You can also save your extra money, and upgrade your standard lens. The standard lenses that come with the D40 and Rebel XTi are quite poor. It's better to get something like a Tamron 17-50/2.8 for Nikon and Canon, or the Sigma 17-70 for Nikon, Canon and Pentax. These lenses cost $200-$300 more, but give excellent optics for the money..

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of the Pentax K10D, and I own one. I'm extremely happy with it. I would strongly recommend it to any photographic enthusiast who is keen on a serious photographic tool, especially for street photography. If you're interested in learning more about photography, then the K10D is a good choice. But if you just want a point and shoot with slightly better capabilities, go with the entry-level DSLRs..

Hope this helps and good luck!..

Comment #8

I get what youre saying and agree with your opinion on the k10d.its become more of a 2 horse race at this point.the absence of inbody af on the d40x put it out of consideration..

The d80 is close $ wise. id be et on the 400d but I'm concerned with it's metering...

Comment #9

Paz9x wrote:.

I get what youre saying and agree with your opinion on the k10d.its become more of a 2 horse race at this point.the absence of inbody af on the d40x put it out of consideration.the d80 is close $ wise. id be et on the 400d but I'm concerned withits metering..

I wouldn't count out the Nikon D40x. The AF-S lens lineup is sufficient for most entry-level photographers. Is there are particular lens that you want that isn't in the lineup? If so, the D80 or the Canon 400D are good choices..

BTW, have you actually tried these cameras in the store? Before making your final buying decision, try them out. Here are a few basic things to look for when you "Test drive" a DSLR:.

1. Hold it in your hands. Is it reasonably comfortable?.

2. Turn it on and off. Try aiming it and focusing it at various objects. Does the camera turn on fast enough? Is it responsive enough for your needs?.

3. Ask the salesperson to show you how to use it. Have him/her show you how to:- Change scene modes- Change the white balance- Change the ISO senstivity.

These are very typical controls that many people change. Do the controls seem intuitive to you? Does the menu system give you enough feedback that you don't feel 'lost' in the camera?.

4. If you understand aperture and shutter priority, play around with those modes. Are the controls to change aperture and shutter speed intutive to you?.

5. Look through the viewfinder. Does it give you a big enough view? (you'll see a dramatic difference between the Canon 400D and the Pentax K10D. The Pentax is much, much better)..

6. Does the camera feel solid to you? Open and close the battery door and the memory card door. Do they feel reasonably solid, or will they break after repeated use?..

Comment #10

All of these are good cameras and it won't make any significant difference to your pictures which one you choose. Have a look at this article by Ken Rockwell. He gets a lot of negative comments because of his love of all things Nikon, but I think he's dead right here..

Http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/notcamera.htm.

Best wishesMike..

Comment #11

Thank you for the replies.No, I'm currently unable to get these in store to get a feel for them..

I will do so as soon as I can. While id prefer to not pay as much as the d80 costs. That is what I will probably do, barring a much prefer the feel of the 400d..

The lower price and similar image quality are keeping the 400d close, I just think the lack of spot metering will really bother me..

Im not looking to buy another camera for a very long time. I will glady pay a bit extra to ensure Im happy with which ever I choose..

Im now debating on my place of purchase, the prices are very appealing on ebay, though id MUCH rather buy from a retailer...

Comment #12

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